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1996 Grand Caravan LE won't shift out of 2nd

14K views 19 replies 9 participants last post by  96le 
#1 ·
I have a 96 Grand Caravan LE 3.8

It's got 194,000 on it never had an issue and runs great...one of the best vehicles we've ever owned.

OK so my wife is driving to work and it's fine at first, then a couple of miles down the road at the stop light she goes... 1st...2nd...slips...revs...hits 2nd...stays in second. She stops starts again...same thing. No problem with reverse 1st or 2nd...no 3rd or 4th.
There is no noises and fluid is clean. I threw it on OBD2 scanner and it came up with code=720 (output speed sensor) so I changed the sensor...still exactly the same. I scanned it again after driving a few miles now no codes but still not shifting into 3rd. Any suggestions?:cry:
 
#3 ·
Are you sure that you have 1st? it may be in Limp Home Mode. If so you will only have reverse and second. This is what happens when one of the sensors are out of spec. It could be as simple as an input or output speed sensor, PRNDL switch or solenoid pack. If the output speed sensor is bad your speedometer will not work. Usually this happens without notice. Don't let a trans shop tell you that your trans is shot without scanning it. If the fluid is clean like you say it is likely there is nothing major wrong. If you don't figure it out yourself you need to find someone with a Factory or OTC, Snap On scanner to read everything. Your scanner will not. It sounds like something that can be repaired easily unless the lined cluches are worn out. One of these scanners should be able to deternine that.
 
#4 ·
The 604 can be completely grenaded with pieces in the pan big enough to see the part numbers and the fluid will "look" good. You cannot go by this. The typical failure is NOT burnt clutches on these but typiclally a snapped hard part or planetary failure. Neither of which will discolor the fluid
 
#5 ·
The 604 can be completely grenaded with pieces in the pan big enough to see the part numbers and the fluid will "look" good. You cannot go by this. The typical failure is NOT burnt clutches on these but typiclally a snapped hard part or planetary failure. Neither of which will discolor the fluid
Buy these failures will cause other kinds of problems...like no movement in any gear or chunks of metal in the pan.

There are many trans shops that say the trans is destroyed when it in fact is a solenoid pack, sensor or switch.
 
#7 ·
From what I read in the factory transmission diagnostic charts, a 1-2 flair back to 2nd very commonly a broken overdrive hub or stripped splines on this hub. My tranny guys also say this is really common and the way to tell it's this vs a clutch problem is that with a clutch problem, something called CVI's will show way out of whack and there be a lot of clutch material in the pan. if its a broken hub, fluid will be nice still and cvi's will be normal.
 
#8 ·
These trannys are "SMART", you can go to a tranny shop and they can connect it to a scanner and it will "TELL" them what the status of each clutch and band is. Go to 2 or 3 tranny shops and get it scanned, get a print-out to take with you.

DO NOT GO TO AA***, unless you want to take you tranny home in a "doggy bag".
:lol:

On the other hand, You have 194kmiles, it has served well. If it's NOT a failure, you're probably close to having one, anyway. Yes, some trannys will go over 200kmiles (right guys?), others grenade by 140kmiles. YMMV (your mileage may vary). You may be further ahead, simply by selecting a tranny shop and getting it rebuilt. You'll be good to go for another 190kmiles .... :thumb:

Call around and ask what a 1996 A604/41TE costs to rebuild (get them to send you a quote and hold them to it).
 
#9 ·
These trannys are "SMART", you can go to a tranny shop and they can connect it to a scanner and it will "TELL" them what the status of each clutch and band is. Go to 2 or 3 tranny shops and get it scanned, get a print-out to take with you.

DO NOT GO TO AA***, unless you want to take you tranny home in a "doggy bag".
:lol:

On the other hand, You have 194kmiles, it has served well. If it's NOT a failure, you're probably close to having one, anyway. Yes, some trannys will go over 200kmiles (right guys?), others grenade by 140kmiles. YMMV (your mileage may vary). You may be further ahead, simply by selecting a tranny shop and getting it rebuilt. You'll be good to go for another 190kmiles .... :thumb:

Call around and ask what a 1996 A604/41TE costs to rebuild (get them to send you a quote and hold them to it).

Band? According the Chrysler A-604 Ultradrive Electronic Automatic Transaxle Student Reference book, there are no bands in these transmissions. I went to a couple trans rebuilding web sites (transonline and Atraonline) and cant find any band information on the 604 either. I'm thinking that according to what I was able to research on this problem the overdrive hub looks to be about a 90% probability expecially with the proper description given about the 1-2-slip no 3rd. according to the apply charts, this is how the trans clutches apply.... 1st Underdrive-Low/rev, 2nd underdrive-2/4, 3rd underdrive-overdrive 4th overdrive-2/4 and reverse is rev-low/rev

In this explaination the first clutch listed is an input clutch and the 2nd is the holding clutch (except in 3rd where under-over are both input clutches that lock all planetaries together creating direct drive 1:1 gear ratio)

I bet the code found will be 'gear ratio error 3rd' and/or fault after a shift.

I sure hope there failure isn't because someone put the wrong fluid in. I read that if you put in Dexron or something other than ATF+4 you MUST have the entire transmission rebuilt with all new clutches and torque converter as the wrong fluid will saturate and soak into the clutches and be permenantly absorbed into the clutch fibers.
 
#11 ·
No, I'm not making a mountain out of a molehill. I feel it is crucial to provide 100% accurate information instead of internet mis-information. According to chrysler, in 1989 the 604 transmission was a completely unique transmission with no common parts. The 413, 404, 415, 470, 670 and 31th transmissions are closely based on the 904 trans which is identical in operation and design to the 727 which is a more heavy duty version. all these 3 speed transmissions use 2 clutch packs and 2 bands and one one-way roller clutch. There is no transmission computer or any computer diagnostics for this trans other than electronically controlled lockup torque converter. the shift control for all these transmissions is 1st forward clutch (aka rear clutch)-one way roller or low/reverse band depending on trans manual valve position, 2nd is forward and intermediate band, 3rd is High/Reverse clutch (aka front clutch) - rear clutch. Reverse is the front clutch and Low/reverse band

additionally the rwd overdrive transmission A500 A518 are based on the old 904/727 but with an overdrive unit added where the tailshaft housing was. the 500 is a 904 w/overdrive and the 518 is a 727 w/overdrive

Sorry for being apparently argumentative, but again, isn't is important to present factual information instead of ambiguous inaccurate information?
 
#12 ·
1996 Caravan won't shift sometimes out of 2nd gear. I read your post about this and just want to make sure of a few things. I have same issue sometimes. Only way to fix, is turn van off, and restart, and it will usually fix it, but it's getting worse.

I brought to a ship and he put on his machine and he said I need "a new controller, and solenoid". WHen he says controller, is that the tcm you mentioned in your post? He wants $1,000 for install with parts. I just want to buy the right stuff and fix it will a friend of mine. Please advise.

and here is where I read about the issue: http://ricksfreeautorepairadvice.com/wont-shift-out-of-second-gear/

Thoughts? I just want to be sure I get the right parts.
 
#13 ·
Hi Jackie1, welcome to the forum!

Do you know what trouble codes are set? That will help us help you.

Solenoid pack failure is somewhat common (I had to do my solenoid pack earlier this year); it is a $150 part if you do it yourself, but please be aware that quite a lot of care and cleanliness is involved in this job. Problems with the transmission's wiring harness and connector are also occasional. TCM failure is quite unusual; I can't remember anyone having trouble with that here on this forum anyhow.

Once I replaced my solenoid pack, it actually took a few months before shifting returned 100% to normal -- initially it was a bit harsh at times. A "quick learn" at a dealership probably would have solved that for me much faster.

- G
 
#16 ·
Once I replaced my solenoid pack, it actually took a few months before shifting returned 100% to normal -- initially it was a bit harsh at times. A "quick learn" at a dealership probably would have solved that for me much faster.

- G
Expect up to 70 restarts to get things back to normal (relearned).
 
#14 ·
Ok, I did some shopping around a found a place that has worked on these vehicles quite a bit. I paid $490 with tax. Here is what was done.

1) Diagnostic code 22 & 28, $35
2) New solenoid, $205 (I think they got it from the dealer) part # 05140429aa
3) B-102 Transmission filter kit $21.50
4) Wolf's Head ATV fluid, 4 quarts I think, $21
4) 3 hours labor to replace sold pack and service transmission, $180 labor

total $490 with tax. Did I do ok? With what you said about this being a little tricky, I didn't want to do it, and get a 1 year warranty with this guy.
 
#15 ·
The only thing I'd comment on is to make sure that the ATF is Chrysler-licensed ATF+4, and not a "universal" ATF, no matter how much the ATF manufacturer's literature claims it is usable in Chrysler transmissions. Wolfs Head apparently manufactures both types; just make sure it is a Chrysler-licensed ATF+4 product that was used (or else the shop should be held liable for any damage caused by the non-licensed ATF, with the presumption being any ensuing failure is caused by the incorrect ATF).

- G
 
#20 ·
I know it's been a long time and I do apologize for not updating this thread since I posted it but I forgot all about it. Anyway the problem I had was my Caravan was in "Limp mode" which only allowed it to shift from 1st to 2nd gear. It had high mileage but what I believe what actually caused the problem was the radiator wasn't cooling the tranny fluid very well (no external cooler). I realized this after I had the tranny rebuilt and there was a different issue so I had it on the computer scanner and noticed the cooling temp was higher than acceptable. I don't remember but it was 220-230 degrees don't remember exactly so I went and installed a new radiator and the temp was normal after that. Transmission was probably weak anyhow because of the mileage so it didn't take much to damage it.

So here I am Sept. 2018 and I still have this van and it now has 295,000 miles on it. The rebuild on the tranny was good cuz I've put over 101,000 on the rebuilt tranny. I was using it as a third (backup) vehicle and I gotta say it's served us well....A/C still works front & back. Unfortunately now I have an engine problem. I haven't had a chance to take it apart yet but I'm pretty sure the rocker arm stud broke (still runs) and it's knocking bad and there's a hole in the valve cover on the back head (under the wipers) so I'm pretty sure it's the rocker arm stud broke and whatever else broke along with it.

I know it's got a lot of miles but I'm thinking I may replace the head and get a few more years out of it. My wife says I should junk it.
I'll try and remember to update this thread a little sooner than 9 years. lol

Thanks
 
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