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No heat - maybe bad blend door linkage

58K views 29 replies 11 participants last post by  imickey503 
#1 ·
I've been procrastinating on repairing my 2003 DGC SE 3.3L that right now has no heat. Winter's approaching soon and it won't be fun without some nice warm air.

I've checked the coolant level, it's OK. Both input and output heater hoses at the firewall are hot so I don't think the heater core has any obstructions. I am fairly certain the blend door is stuck in a position to allow only cold A/C through. Prior to the problem initially seen last Spring, I had heat (HOT!) and over the course of 1-2 days it started getting flaky whenever I moved the manual temperature control dial. Then the heat finally quit, or more accurately I'd say it was stuck on cold.

I recently pulled some of the lower dash components off and looked at the blend motor and linkage on the driver side and the linkage end of the motor had what looked like a plastic geared wheel and there was nothing attached to the other end. I stuck my finger into a hole on the main housing(?) where the motor normally attaches and could feel the linkage that was likely once connected to that geared wheel on the motor. (Perhaps the act of pulling the motor off the housing made the blend door linkage fall off???). Of course, getting to it would take a major tear-down of the dash. There isn't anything in the Dodge Factory Service Manual to provide that level of detail so I don't really know exactly how the motor and blend door linkage come together to move the blend door. In fact, I couldn't even find the blend door.

I have not checked the actual motor itself, I'll assume it is OK for now since I *think* the linkage is the problem.

OK, long story short, has anyone pulled apart the dash and had to reattach linkage for the blend door? I'd like to get some ideas before I punt and take it to a Dodge service shop for a diagnostic estimate. Quite frankly, it doesn't look like a trivial task and may be a lot more involved than I want to take on.

My van is an SE model with a single zone heating system and there is only blend door and motor on the driver's side of the radio console.


-Dave
 
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#2 ·
So far, no responses and no solution, yet. The urgency to get it fixed hasn't been so great now that the family's daily driver is an '08 Civic. The van has been relegated to part-time driving use.

I tried to sell it but for the prices I have been offered ($2K max) I'd much rather keep it as a spare vehicle. It's still runs great and I know all of it's history.

Anyway, I made another attempt to diagnose the problem. So far I notice this:

- temperature gauge is normal, just below the 1/2-way mark.
- coolant level seems to be normal, both in radiator and in the overflow reservoir.
- upper radiator hose is hot.
- both input and output heater hoses are hot. The heater core itself is also hot.
- all HVAC control servos seem to be working, especially the temperature control servo. I checked each control individually and I could hear a servo whirring when the control position was moved.
- I ran the blend door calibration procedure, it operated in the normal time frame (under 2 minutes) and came up with no error codes.
- still no heat, only cool or cold air!

Has anyone pulled apart the dash to fix either the door itself or the linkage between the servo and the door? Or, has anyone had a similar problem repaired by a service shop? I'm tempted to take it to a dealership and spend the $90 or so for a diagnosis. Hopefully they will either come back with some relatively easy fix that I've overlooked, or come up with the same diagnosis as I expect to hear (blend door not moving due to broken door or bad linkage) with a repair price that isn't too outrageous.

Anyone have any similar experiences with the HVAC or a dash teardown?
 
#3 ·
Sounds like you may have a diaphram leak, or vacuum leak from the controls to one of the louvers. I had heard of a TSB about the seal, on some models, that tends to loosen and block the functionality of the mixing door. May just want to stop by the dealer's and ask some questions. Some info is free.

Give it a couple of days, you'll get more ideas from forum members.

Best wishes
 
#4 ·
According to the FSM, all doors in the HVAC system directing air into the cabin are servo-driven rather than a vacuum driven. I'm at a point where I'll have to hit up one or more dealerships for some service advice, maybe they will give away a few nuggets of information that will allow me to fix the probllem. Right now though, I'm fairly convinced the linkage on the servo motor is not attached to the door; I can see there is a toothed gear on the servo but whatever it normally attaches to seems to have fallen into the distribution system, and that sucker is buried deep under the dash. I don't mind taking a few things apart, but disassembling the entire dash to get to that is beyond my comfort level. Just maybe I can find out a way to reattach linkage without going through that hassle.
 
#5 ·
I've gone digging again under my dash to look further into why my blend door is not functioning, or more appropriately why I don't have even the slightest indication of heat or temperature variation. It's always cold. Moving the manual temperature control dial causes the blend door motor to move back and forth as expected. That appears to be good. However, and this is the odd part, the geared wheel on the end of the servo motor is attached to nothing. It is clearly meant to engage something in the AC/heater box but there is nothing but a hole and nothing immediately inside the hole to engage. There is no linkage anywhere to be found. The adjacent servo motor controlling the different vents has a complex gearing mechanism but I don't see anything for the blend door. In fact, I don't even see a blend door, per se. I don't see any moving doors or parts except for the venting servo mechanism.

So, what does the blend door look like? BTW, I am observing everything under the dash on the driver's side, next to the heater core. I have an FSM but even that is vague on how the actuator motor attaches to the AC/heater box and/or door. There is mention of a blend air door shaft and I suspect that piece is gone, perhaps it came loose and was swallowed up by the AC/heater box. I have no intention of pulling apart the entire dash to get into that box but also have no plan to pay someone $1000 to do it either. :(

Has anyone attempted to fix a blend air door? Ideas are welcome.
 
#6 ·
Sounds like it's time to visit the Bone Yard and see if you can find a similar vehicle and pull the entire box out and do a swap. OR worse case, take a look at the configuration of one intact and see what's missing on yours.

Best Wishes
 
#7 ·
bump.............

Sorry I don't have any solutions for you Dave. The only blend door I've had to work on was my Merc Sable and it was quite obvious and could be manually moved by reaching under the dash.

I'm surprised their hasn't been more suggestions in the length this has been posted?!?!?! Maybe goes to the reliability of this component and thus the near total lack of suggestions from forum members..........

Merry Christmas
Rich
 
#8 ·
Well, I broke down and had a dealer service department look it and they confirmed what I already knew: the blend door was broken and it was stuck in a position that blocked all warm air. Their repair estimate: $1400. Eeek! I paid for their diagnosis effort and brought it back home to mull things over.

I am at least thankful this is no longer a daily driver vehicle and the fact it doesn't get too cold here in Virginia so it will get driven on occasion over the winter. So now the plan looks like I will wait for Spring and then pull apart the entire dash to get at the heater box and make the repairs. Right now, I simply do not have the motivation (or desperation) to tackle a 2-day job.
 
#9 ·
'03 Town and Country Passenger side heat--cold only

The Manual control for the passenger side of our T&C doesn't change the air temp coming out of the heater--fine for summer, but winter is coming and we're in northern Minnesota.

Any help will be much appreciated.

What's the easiest way to access the blend door/actuator for the passenger side? Is it found on the passenger side under the dash?

How much will I need to take apart to find it? I know that I'll need to disconnect the negative battery terminal to prevent being punched in the face by the airbag.

Please give me any suggestions and help. Thanks for your time.

Dudley
 
#10 ·
Not sure if this will work but Ford has issues with broken stuck blend doors and people found a way to cut the blend door out from the box and slide a new one in and glue the housing back together without removing the HVAC box. If there is a will there is a way.
 
#11 ·
I've seen posts on hear of people doing a similar fix--I'm just wondering what the easiest way is to get at the blend door location. If it's on the passenger side or driver side? I'm guessing it's on the passenger side since that's the side that doesn't have heat right now--but I really don't want to tear apart the wrong location.

Any one have any tips on the easiest way to get at the blend door for a '03 with driver and passenger manual heat controls? Thanks.

Dudley92
 
#12 ·
That is exactly what I did. I cut a hole in the air box and pulled out the door with the broken shaft and repaired it. The fix lasted about a week. I thought the repaired shaft was at least as strong as an undamaged door shaft but apparently I was wrong. I haven't gone back to fix it again, and actually I wonder if the calibration process is somehow flawed (faulty controller?) because it seemed possible the door was being torqued by the motor beyond it's normal stop position, thereby breaking the shaft the first time and the second time.

Here's the technique used, refer to the posts between myself and gordo.
http://forum.chryslerminivan.net/showthread.php?t=11969
 
#14 ·
Wow! This thread is so old, all I can hear is crickets chirping. However, I'm hoping. Dave, I literally laughed out loud more than once at your description of your problem. I'm hoping that, in a fit of nostalgia, you check this thread and respond. Did you ever actually fix your blend door or did you throw in the towel. I'm thinking that the third option, having it repaired to the tune of 1400 bucks, was not really ever an option at all. Suffering from the same issues in Ontario, which is decidedly cooler that Virginia.
Jeff
 
#16 ·
2018 recap of events on how to do this and a video from me to follow in the future.

Oh look. Another thread that I am going to have to make a VIDEO about HOW TO FIX.

Last post on this was in 2015. So far there is only this video out about it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eeZBbFGIQ0w

This post goes into how to get to the VENT flap:

https://forum.chryslerminivan.net/showthread.php/11969-No-Heat-2007-Town-amp-Country

Basically, you are going to have to pull apart the entire dash assembly. ALL OF IT.


This is him showing the location of where he went in and got the access to it.


Shows where the hole was cut


User Gordo bernard posted this:
Sorry I didn't take any pics of the access hole.





This is how he went about the repair:
I used a 1/8 inch diameter burr in the "Dremel" tool because room is so tight and it is a bit of a convoluted shape. The plastic is only about 0.040" thick, so don't allow the cutter to go in more than a 1/4" so you won't even cut anything inside the box. When cutting polypropylene like the airbox, you will find that the plastic tends to melt a little bit and refill the groove that you just cut. This is not a problem. After cutting the whole shape it can be pried out with a flat screwdriver. Any little bits of the melted plastic that remain in place can and should be just flaked off with your fingertips. The Bondo that I used on the access hole was a glass reinforced type. Roughen up the faces with the Dremel tool where you want the Bondo to stick. The idea is not to fill the gap as too much Bondo oozing through would have its own problems. You can use the actuator, its two mounting screws and shaft hole to locate it back in position and then just use a couple of dabs of Bondo to hold it in place. After 20 minutes have passed then remove the actuator and blob on more Bondo to cover the groove, just keep it away from the "flap's" shaft (you will remember to put the flap/shaft back in place before Bondoing the door in place?) You can even squeeze the actuator back in place and screw it down while the Bondo is wet. An easy way to stop the Bondo from sticking to the shaft or the actuator, is to put masking tape on these two parts. As the Bondo is curing, it gets hot and this breaks the glue bond of the masking tape and then the parts are easily separated. Remember too that Bondo is super easy to trim with an Exacto knife when it is no longer sticky and has just started to get warm.
COntinuity in next thread due to image limit.
 
#17 ·
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OK, I managed to fish out the shaft piece using a vacuum, the attached photo is what it all looks like. So far ... so good.


I'm back...Cut the rubber off in the areas marked in green. Are you familiar with what a 1/4" socket head cap screw is?(1/4 x 20 thread, a small round head that requires an Allen wrench to tighten)

You will need four items to finish the job.
1- epoxy putty (comes in a tube and shape and size of a hot dog)
1- small can of Bondo (or any body filler)
1- 1/4" nut
1- 1/4-20 socket head cap screw


You should be able to get all this stuff at an auto supply place or first two at Walmart and second two at Home Depot for under 20 bucks and have tons left over.



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#18 ·
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The screw will fit nice and tightly in a 1/4" drilled hole(just use a hand drill). The head of the screw will fit nicely deep down in the end of the broken shaft piece. In my picture I show the screw head in the hole with some putty under the screw head for support, some extra putty along the screw's shaft and some around the nut (I had to grind a little off of three sides of the nut to get it to drop into that spot. The epoxy putty would very likely be enough without the nut if you bought the metal reinforced type). You obviously need to drill a hole in three places for the screw. Try to drill the holes straight or worst case, you drill the hole a little bigger and it will still work.

Test fit all the parts without any glue.
If you are happy with the fit, use some crazy glue to reassemble the plastic bits of the flap/shaft...let dry a minute.
Mix a tiny batch of putty, put some around the shaft of the screw under the screw head, shove the screw into the hole and tighten into the nut. This will pack the putty under the head very nicely. Try to keep the splines clean where the actuator fits into.( cleans up very well with rubbing alcohol).

Let this set for 10 minutes and mix up some more putty to pack around the screw shaft, nut and anywhere else you think it needs some. Don't blob on too much though because the shaft shouldn't get any larger in diameter.

That's it for the door repair. Really quite simple but long winded to make sure you could visualize what I was saying.


OK, the job is now finished! I repaired the door shaft with a 1/4-20x2" cap-head screw and liquid epoxy. I then contemplated using Bondo-brand fiberglass resin jelly to reattach the cutout "access door" but decided to use an epoxy putty instead. I thought it might be easier to work with. I was careful to select a putty that would adhere to polypropolene or ABS plastic. So far, it seems to be holding just fine.

With everything put together I recalibrated the actuator control system and I now have heat and A/C. The manual temperature control works as intended. I wish I had this solution last October!

Total cost of the materials: $18 ($10 for two packages of epoxy, $5 for a 1/8" dremel tool bit, and $3 for hardware). The local dealer wanted to replace the heat/AC airbox and charge about 10 hours of labor, for about $1400. I doubt my van is even worth that much.

Gordo, THANKS for your efforts to find a workable solution without breaking the bank! :ThumbsUp:






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#19 ·
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This blend door part really does need a good Plastic weld or a way to fix it Properly with no weak points. Why? :

Here's a picture of the blend door repaired a second time. A heavy dose of Devcon brand "High-Strength Plastic Welder" seems to be holding up.


Another person posted that they was a TSB out that has the upgraded shaft and parts. I would really look into that.

I add to this thread the following for what it is worth...

There was/is a service bulletin for the Passenger side blend door. Number 24-006-01 dated may 4 2001 which covered the replacement of the blend door shaft with a upgraded shaft. This for vehicles with the 3 zone sdystem. The new shaft is part number 04885511AA Shaft, Blend Air Door, Labor is given at 0.4 hrs.

Pasrt price was given this AM from local dealer at $3.00

The subject of this Bulletin was/is: No Heat on Front Right Side.
Rob

Code:
[SIZE="5"][B][COLOR="darkorange"][U]THIS IMAGE IS ONLY FOR 4TH GENERATION MODELS[/U][/COLOR][/B][/SIZE]
[QUOTE="FeMaster, post: 0"]Don't know what year you are looking at, but here is the Blend Actuator Diagram out of my 2002 Service Manual.  Might help, might not.  Depends on if they made any changes in the years... For the Left-Hand Drive Models.[/QUOTE]
 

[IMG]https://forum.chryslerminivan.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=4709&d=1343613444[/IMG]


[SIZE="5"][B][COLOR="darkorange"][U]THIS IMAGE IS ONLY FOR 4TH GENERATION MODELS[/U][/COLOR][/B][/SIZE]

So if the HVAC-DOOR-FLAP keeps breaking with NEW doors, then this user said that it may also be the motor not giving a signal back to the computer:

Since you have already tried different HVAC head units, it really sounds like the actuator motor itself may be bad. Yeah, it sound strange, being that it moves the door, BUT these motors are also supposed to send a signal back to the HVAC unit with the doors position. Since it is going past it's stop point and continues to try to move it further, that would be my next guess.

If you can, try swapping out a known working motor (recirc door, etc.) with the one that is having the problem. According to the service manual, they are completely interchangeable.


Below is a quote from the service manual, which explains things a bit better than I can...
 
#20 ·
USER Bryan Bennett did this to fix his problem:


I just did a 03 town and country with manual temp control.I removed the heater core and was able to reach up into the distribution box through the heater core opening and remove the broken blend door out through the heater core opening.I repaired the door in a fashion that now makes it 2 pieces as that was the only way to get it back in without cutting the box.I slid the repaired door back into place and then slide in the modified pivot/internal splined end that the actuator engages into_Once installed the actuator hold the removable pivot in ....so it cannot walk back out. It took some thought but it worked perfect and no cutting of the distribution box was nessesary and I am sure that door wont break again















 
#21 ·
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when the door is repaired ..the repair needs to be heavy duty enough to live through the recalibration process------

that's why I repaired the door as I did in the prior pics----
then you have to be able to get it back in...SO .....I made it be 2 pieces ------

R&R of the door was easy after the heater core removal (which is also easy).
Sorry...but...I could not ever cut/butcher a customers box like some have done.[/QUOTE]



PAT had this to say on again why it MIGHT be breaking, and this might have to do with the motor applying way to much force on the flap:
The reason these break in the first place is that the actuator goes to far in its cycle of opening and closing which weakens the plastic, your fix might just work.........:)






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#23 ·
GerorgeF had this to say about getting the OEM replacement part. I don't know if this is the upgraded unit.

01TC,

When searching for parts in the past I have found that sometimes you need to drop leading zeros from Chrysler part numbers. The blend door shaft shows up on chryslerpartsdirect.com under part number 4885511AA.

George
However, when I went to go look for that part number, nothing comes up.

But here is a list of all the HVAC stuff.


https://www.factorychryslerparts.co...e=0&isAccessory=0&isPerformance=0&searchTerm=

THis is what they have listed as a Blend door


ACTUATOR. RIGHT AND LEFT. BLEND DOOR.
Part Number: 04734058AB (04734058; 04734057)
ACTUATOR, Blend Air Door, ACTUATOR, Blend Air Door/Passenger Zone, ACTUATOR, Zone, Driver.

20 people have looked at this part recently
Ships Fast From Bartow, F
l








HEATER AND A/C UNIT, ZONE (1/1)







This product fits 354 vehicle variants.
Chrysler: 3 models, 58 variants between 1996 and 2000.

Dodge: 4 models, 203 variants between 1996 and 2011.

Jeep: 2 models, 19 variants between 1997 and 2002.

Plymouth: 3 models, 74 variants between 1996 and 1999.
 
#24 ·
#25 ·
Another great thread on this.
https://forum.chryslerminivan.net/showthread.php/16672-Heat-one-side-cold-the-other....

Pictures as promised....enjoy.

Info about each pictured typed below the pic:




Here is where the action takes place. We will be working near the gas pedal...a bit above it and nearer the heating controls....




Here you see a cover where I already have some screws out. There are three total holding it on and two tabs at the rear.




And here is that cover removed.




This pic is a little too close but you can now see a brownish thing with two pipes - heater core and pipes. You can also now see the actuators and some gears. These are the control for the vent settings and the blend doors. The picture shows the actuator and a bit of the shaft for the passenger side blend door. Mine is stuck on cold. When calling for heat you see the shaft attempt to move but stop. The driver's side - well there you see some gears move positions properly when calling for heat or cold....but passenger side....nada. Just some attempt at a move and then nothing.




Three screws hold the actuator on. They were easy to remove. The clip for the wire connectors....not so much but I did get it off after several minutes of cussing. But hand I can flip the blend door no problem and the passenger side gets heat or cold properly. Yes!....Great news because getting to the blend door.....ain;t gonna happen without a dash tear down. At this point I'm thinking I have a faulty actuator.




The little bugger with the cover off. I could not spin this thing to save my life.




But....take out the motor and I can spin the motor no problem and the gears in the case no problem. Put them back together and nothing spins.
 
#26 ·
Can't get one dash panel off - Help!

This is a fantastic writeup! Thank you so much.

I'm in the middle of trying to access the blend door to restore heat to my 2006 T&C. As the photo shows I've gotten all the panels off except for the large grey one the driver's side. I removed two screws from the bottom but do not see any other fasteners, yet the panel seems rigidly connected at the rear and top edges. Any tips greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!

Auto part Engine Vehicle Bumper Automotive exterior
 
#27 ·
This is a fantastic writeup! Thank you so much.

I'm in the middle of trying to access the blend door to restore heat to my 2006 T&C. As the photo shows I've gotten all the panels off except for the large grey one the driver's side. I removed two screws from the bottom but do not see any other fasteners, yet the panel seems rigidly connected at the rear and top edges. Any tips greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!

View attachment 52835
Perhaps it's jammed. Can you wiggle it? If not, maybe it needs to be popped off but I doubt it. Should be simple to remove.
 
#29 ·
I rushed into this job and after pulling apart half the dash, I realized it wasn't necessary, as the area I need to access is up alongside the pedal box. Now my question is, How does a normal-size person get their hands and a wrench up in there and be able also to see what they're doing. Seems like removal of the driver's seat is necessary and even then it will be a squeeze. Any tips welcome.
 
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